Behind the Mic: The Coffee With Rhonda Williams

Michelle Abraham: 00:00:03

This is amplify you the podcast about you discovering your message and broadcasting to the world. If you're a coach, author or speaker, you'll want to tune in. If you're looking for the best return on your time investment to get your message out to the world in a bigger way. We're giving you full access behind the scenes look of how we're running our podcasts, how our clients have found success and what you can do to launch your podcast today. The world needs your message. I'm Michelle Abraham, the host join my family as we unleash your unique genius and find the connections you need to launch your venture today. Join us and let's get amplified hello hello amplify you founding Michelle Abraham your host here today. I am super excited to bring you a half the extra and behind the mic interview we kind of combining the both from in together with my amazing guests Rhonda Williams. Hey Rhonda, how are you?

Rhonda Williams: 00:00:59

I'm fantastic. Michelle, so great to be here with you.

Michelle Abraham: 00:01:01

Yeah, so glad you're here too. So amplify your family. Let me tell you a little bit more about Rhonda Rhonda is an elite leadership coach. She specializes in emotional intelligence and strategy around emotional intelligence, and women of color advancements strategists. So with POS executive roles in health care, such as the chief nursing officer and hospital CEO, Rhonda has personally experienced the effects of overwhelming stress. I bet after a pair of dueling life crisises Rhonda decided to stop the madness. And today she is known as the stress free leader. And she helps leaders and entrepreneurs who feel there are simply not enough hours in the day to transition into stress be leading, she also coaches women of color to prepare for and pursue executive leadership roles. This is the house She's also the host, which is why we're doing behind the scenes behind the mic and also ask the expert. She's the host of the coffee with Rhonda show. So Rhonda, I'm so glad you're here. And we're gonna dive right in. Wonderful. Michelle, I'm looking forward to it. Awesome. So let's start with the coffee with wanting to show. So tell us a little bit about show how long you've had it for how you kind of have started and what was the journey? What was your vision for your show?

Rhonda Williams: 00:02:17

Yeah, so I you know, this story is always so interesting for me. So the coffee with Rhonda show started about two and a half years ago. And I was in a position where I was doing all of my leadership stuff. But I wanted to start to have conversations with leaders, where we could talk about things that were not always talked about, particularly in the workspace in the workplace, whether you're an entrepreneur, there are some things that we just sort of keep hidden, so that the vision behind the coffee with Rhonda show is grab a cup of coffee or tea or water or whatever you got in your cup, and then come let your hair down, sit down around the table with a group of people, group of leaders, and let's have a conversation. And so that's how the show started. Now, Michelle, when I started this show, I plan to only do it for like a month or so I think I told my co host I recruited some co hosts and I'm like you guys do this with me. We're only gonna do it for a few weeks. It'll be really fun.

Michelle Abraham: 00:03:17

And I was having two years ago.

Rhonda Williams: 00:03:21

Because at the end of that time, my co head and I said, Well, guys, this has been awesome. Thank you so much. This is and everybody said, why would you stop this? This is great. It's really amazing. And I was caught off guard because I was like, well, but I have I didn't have a plan, right? Because I only intended to do it for this short time. But with all the positive feedback, I thought well, okay, if you guys want to keep going, I guess we'll keep going. And so yes, we look back now and that was two and a half years ago, we've grown we've evolved. And it's a full production now. And so it's like super fun.

Michelle Abraham: 00:03:57

That's awesome. I imagine how many co co hosts you have.

Rhonda Williams: 00:04:00

I have two co hosts that are regularly with me. We call them everything is a coffee theme. So we They are my caffeinated co hosts, Raj, Raj Jones and Moray Tila Kima. And so together, we just have a really nice vibe. And then we bring on a special guests each show. So it changes the dynamic just a bit. And we get to dive into those leadership topics that we don't always talk about.

Michelle Abraham: 00:04:26

I think that's awesome. Having co host is so much fun, because it keeps the conversation going if you've run into questions, or if you, you know, everyone has a different perspective on things too, which is really cool. I was in an interview the other day and we were talking about how when you have a co host instead of like when it's a single host and a single guest you're the guest the job of the host is to elevate that guests and really like raise them up. Don't you have other co hosts you actually then on a more of a level playing field and you're having a conversation then it's a little bit different and it's a great kind of feel because Then and what these guys were saying about how they loved having a co host was that then it opened the door for conversations outside of that with this, these experts and allowed them to bring on bigger experts that then they felt like they were on even playing fields with which was really cool.

Rhonda Williams: 00:05:17

Yeah, I think that's exactly right. Michelle, when you what I tell my guests and when they're preparing to come on the show is this is a panel discussion, it is not an interview, right. So we are not interviewing you the way we would if I was having a one on one interview, I have done some special copy with Ron does shows where I have a one, and I can just focus on that guess. But this is really more of a conversation. And each, each of us bring a different perspective. Sometimes we agree to disagree, which can be also interesting. Because it's not just it's not homogenous, we all have our own experiences and opinions. And but it makes for one of our core values. And I think this is important. So I know that your guests are into developing podcasts and growing their podcast, one of the things that was important for us is to establish our core values, right? What were the core values for the show. And one of those core values is for us to provide information education, but also to have fun. So we laugh every show, sometimes we laugh uncontrollably. Somebody will say something really crazy, or super fun. And and my do my show is live streaming. So it can it can be a little bit crazy. But it's all in good fun.

Michelle Abraham: 00:06:33

That's awesome. I love that you guys have fun. Do you find it hard or difficult to manage the three hosts, you guys have a system in place so that you're not cutting off each other or jumping in? I think that was something that I would think of? That's a bit of a challenge when you have more than one host?

Rhonda Williams: 00:06:48

Yeah, it's been interesting. I've gotten better at it for sure. When I first started, it was probably a little bit clunkier. But now I think we have a really good flow and and part of the way that we control that is that I am the facilitator, right? So I'm bringing everyone's voice and I don't let it go too long without any one person being, you know, having their voice heard. So we take turns. And then if someone has something to say, or they want to respond to a point that will just say something like, Oh, can I add a point here, or I wanted to add and then we give them that space to do that. But really I facilitate the conversation so that all the voices are heard, and people don't feel like they have to try to break in to be hurt.

Michelle Abraham: 00:07:30

Yeah, those that are competing over each other for their voice. Right? I see. And also, it doesn't make for great listening experience for your listeners, either when you have a host competing over each other for for the microphone.

Rhonda Williams: 00:07:42

Exactly, exactly. It's it can be it can get a little awkward if you have that kind of dynamic. But you know, we also have roles. So if you have a show with a co host, I think talking to the team about what are the roles that we play. So I'm the moderator and the facilitator. Moray is also another person who really also brings a really deep perspective. And she's had a lot of experience. She's a female engineer by background. And so she's been in male dominated spaces. So she brings a great perspective. And then Roz also has her own business. But she also is incredibly funny. And so and, and she plays it and she contributes that to the discussion. So we meld that along with her great input, she's gonna contribute something funny. And it just makes her really cool, dynamic. So as you are thinking about bringing on co hosts and that sort of thing, I think it's really important to look at personalities, what are their strengths, what's each person going to contribute, so that not everyone is sounding kind of the same.

Michelle Abraham: 00:08:48

I love that. That's really great having rules or jobs within within the episode. For each of you. I think that's really fantastic. Like, sounds like you guys have really thought through this kind of structure of it. And clearly, it's working for you guys. And you've been doing this for a little while now. And it sounds like it's now a smooth running system. And it sounds like it's a fun thing for you to do. And it's like something you enjoy doing every week when you get together with your co hosts. Do you guys find it difficult to find guests for your show? We find it pretty easy.

Rhonda Williams: 00:09:20

You know what so far I've been really finding it pretty easy. I think the challenge and always with guests is those last minute hiccups, right? When you have schedules and for some reason someone says at the last minute Oh, this came up and I can't join then all of a sudden it's kind of like oh, my goodness, okay, gotta rush because you also have the collaterals right, the materials for this show and the assets to get prepared. So that can be a little bit challenging. But for the most part, I've found that I am pretty active on social media. So I will just run across for a meet somebody and I'm like, Oh, you know what, you'd be a great guest for my show. Would you mind filling out application, and then that gives me the rest of the information, I need to completely be comfortable with that. But the other thing is I'm getting also a lot of requests to be on the show. And so then again, I have them complete the application, I don't have a lot of time for a bunch of one on ones. So my application process is really complete. And I'm glad that you brought that up. Because it does a lot of the work for me, I can look at a well done application and say, you would be great for the show, or I don't think this is a fit,

Michelle Abraham: 00:10:29

right? It's great to facts, you really I mean, your show is your, your your baby, right, you really want to protect your audience and make sure you're bringing the right fit and the right value to your show. So that your audience is getting something out of each show. And I love that the application process really helps with that, I find that I that's something I need to add into my podcast because I am in forever just like meeting really cool people and inviting them. It's really hard to have anyone, like apply for my show or anything yet. I just love having amazing people like yourself on here to run it what's been the most impactful episode that you've recorded so far?

Rhonda Williams: 00:11:05

Wow. You know, that's a really great question. I think the most impactful episode is, after the George Floyd situation first happened, we had a group come on to do a special episode. And we got a group of black men to join us on the show. So I think there were three black men that joined and then my two co hosts and myself. And so there was a lot of folks on the show. And we were just talking about how we felt you know about the situation, it was a really powerful show. So that was one. And I also had did one just the week before, where I had a lady guest on the show. And we were planning a completely different topic. But then when that happened, everyone was like, well, we can't really not talk about this, like this is a live show, and people aren't going to expect current events. So we shifted to that. And that show was so incredibly powerful. It was real, it was authentic. And I love that show thinking, wow, I think that's one of the moments where I really knew the power of this platform, and being able to bring authentic voices to important topics and conversations. Mm hmm.

Michelle Abraham: 00:12:20

Yeah, that's amazing. And that's an interesting point that you bring up too, with the difference between having a live show that's recorded live, and then you're going to, you know, have it go on to the podcasting platforms afterwards, versus a pre recorded show, when current events like that come up, you can't really ignore them. So what was your strategy on that? You know, did you have any like, obviously, there's something in the news happens in your recording your show? What does that look like behind the scenes in your show? Is that a call to the guest? Or like, Okay, can we change up what we're going to talk about today? Do you discuss that ahead of time, or you just see what happens when you get on the show together?

Rhonda Williams: 00:12:56

No, I do discuss it ahead of time, because it's super important for me that I respect, not only my guests, but my co hosts also and and say, Hey, I What do you think about this? When it first happened? I'll be honest, I didn't really want to talk about it. It was not on my radar. I was thinking, Okay, I'm staying away from this topic, because it's too emotional and too heavy. And then one of my co hosts said, hey, are we gonna talk about this? And I thought, Oh, well, okay. I guess I guess we could talk about it if you guys want to. That's another thing like my co host. And I, we, we are a partnership, right? We work together. And so yes, it's called coffee with Rhonda. But honestly, they are such an incredibly important part of this show. And and that means a lot to me. So I value their opinion. And then I went to when they said they wanted to talk about it, I went to my guests, and I said, Are you okay? If we shift the conversation? And she said, Oh, yeah, I'd love to talk about this. So that gave us the opportunity. And so yeah, it's important to get everyone because you certainly never want to surprise anyone, or make anyone uncomfortable in that way.

Michelle Abraham: 00:14:09

Right. And it's interesting how having a platform like this really almost forced you to have that those uncomfortable conversations that, you know, you weren't really wanting to have at that time. But happy because of this platform that's interesting, has that maybe you kind of having this kind of platform and you go out of your comfort zone a little bit at times.

Rhonda Williams: 00:14:30

It definitely has Michelle because i i i never considered myself really upgrading that in terms of my life show in that space. But you know, once I did it, I started to understand that this is just a topic in life, just like all the other topics that you're talking about. So there's no need to shy away from them. Be clear that their express opinions you express are your own. And it doesn't mean that you're trying to convince the world of anything or make anyone I was wrong and yourself, right is just an opinion. And we're having a conversation just like we do about everything else. And that has been really, really helpful in terms of me navigating this in my own head, right? Because it was, it was a little challenging at first, but once I did it, then I was kind of like, Okay, this is just a conversation, and I don't need to make it. I don't need to make it any more than that.

Michelle Abraham: 00:15:23

Yeah, yeah. And especially, I mean, that seems like to be like the best. The best way of doing that is really letting people know that it's your opinion only. And I love what you said that you don't try to change anyone's opinion, just expressing your own. Because I think there's so much so much going on in the world right now, where people's opinions are being suppressed, and, you know, not feeling like they can speak out on different topics. And I think, you know, those hard conversations are the ones that will eventually make a difference out there. So having those tough conversations are important. So that's great for you guys.

Rhonda Williams: 00:15:53

You know, Michelle, what, what someone said to me, I was at a conference and one of the speakers said, You know, I think by avoiding hard conversations, we've sort of made things worse. Because it's sort of like being put in in a dark room and allowed to grow and fester. And no one really talked about it. And now all of a sudden, when it explodes. Now we want to talk about it, where really, we should be having difficult conversation all along. Why is that? Well, yeah, why is any subject tap, taboo, if we are all adults, then we can learn to manage our emotions, right to my emotional intelligence background, to navigate and manage our own emotions, and just listen to what's being said, without judgment. Whether or not you agree with it is okay. But just to hear the person and what they have to say. And as my I have a mentor, Casey, he says, everyone is worthy of love and respect, simply because they exist. Right? That's it, period, you exist, you have an opinion, you're worthy of love and respect. What if we all came from that place? Wouldn't that be incredible?

Michelle Abraham: 00:17:01

What a game changer? That would be? Yeah, absolutely. Amazing. I want to switch over to a little bit about your leadership skills and your emotional intelligence, and you're a leadership coach and coach, and you really, you're focusing on the stress free leadership. And it's interesting that you're giving your background, I can imagine being the chief of nursing, next chief nursing officer in a hospital CEO, that is not a stress free environment. So I tell us a little bit about like, how the stress free leader came about, and what's your hope for, you know, really inspiring the world with stress free leading.

Rhonda Williams: 00:17:35

Yeah, you know, it's so interesting. So when I was in those environments, I looked at the models around me to be my guide, and to learn to navigate, right, because you're not born that way. You're just you're growing up, and then an organization and you're looking around going, Oh, okay, this is how it's done. Well, what I learned was that I should give 150% of myself, I should go, go Go 24, seven, and never stop, never turn off. And that made me a great leader. So when I was in those environments, that's exactly what I was doing. It wasn't until I stepped away, that I thought, holy cow, this is all wrong. This is not right. There's there has to be a better way. And I one of the reasons I stepped away is because I said, I'm not happy. This is not making me happy. And I don't really want to do this work, if I'm not going to be able to be happy. And I made that decision. And I think everyone thought I was a little bit crazy when I made that decision. But I really did. I said, I this is not making me happy. And I have to figure out what's going to make me happy. So when I stepped away, I realized that the overwhelming stress that I was accepting in my life was not a good thing. It was not healthy. For me. I was not emotionally Well, it was the ramifications and effects on my family, my physical health, and all of that. It just wasn't worth the price. And so that's when I really began my journey to say, no one taught me how to leave and not carry that type of stress. And that's where I got really passionate about the work that I do coaching with leaders, it took some time to evolve into the stress free part. But here's where I've always been from day one. I want to help leaders transition from the life they live to the life they love. That has always been my mantra. And leaders will look at me and say, What are you talking about? Like, I'm just trying to survive here, right? I'm just trying to get from day to day. And even for entrepreneurs, as you're building your business, you're building your podcasts, all of the work that you're doing, don't lose yourself in the process. I know we've got to we've got to grind and we've got to do the work. But there has to be space for you. Because one of our greatest sources of toxicity comes from within and Doing it to ourselves with the level of stress that we carry, and that we say is acceptable. You know, when cortisol happens in your body, and it's the stress hormone, and it floods your body, because it's thinking, Oh, stress, fight or flight, let me get ready, let me pump all this cortisol into the body, we are now living with that that heightened amount of cortisol in the system. And that's not normal, it affects blood pressure, it affects how your blood sugar is managed, it affects your immune system, it affects your GI system. Everything is affected by this cortisol. So we have to learn that we do not have to carry overwhelming amounts of stress. And nor should we.

Michelle Abraham: 00:20:45

And do you find that female leaders carry more stress? And then the their male counterparts? Like because we tend to, as females be a little bit more emotionally attached? Do you think do you have you found that in your in your work?

Rhonda Williams: 00:20:59

I have, and it is for a lot of reasons. Number one, we are nurtured, we tend to be very nurturing. We want two things to be perfect. We want everyone to like us, right? And we are looking for this external validation consistently. And because sometimes our confidence is not always where it should be. Like, even given all of our amazing accomplishments, we're sometimes still not confident in ourselves and our abilities. So constantly looking externally puts us in a position where we keep those elevated stress levels. And I do find that women carry that differently than men. Now, we're all emotional creatures at our core. But we express that differently, men will walk away a little bit easier and go, I'm just not dealing with this. And we look at them and go, Well, what do you mean, you have to deal with it? Right? Now? Let's talk about it. Right? And think about it, go for it 20 times. And then let's talk about it again, where the perspective that the men have sometimes is one that we should be taking a look at, right when they say, I'm leaving this alone right now, I don't want to deal with this right now. You know what we should be saying? Okay, it's probably healthy for them. Right? Let them have the space that they need. Yeah.

Michelle Abraham: 00:22:19

Yeah, yeah, there's definitely some things that we can learn as women. But I was thinking that, you know, as our podcasters are listening here, they're growing teams, they're there. They're entrepreneurs already. And what are some tips for leaders that are new leaders to really start off on the right foot so that they're not taking on all this stress and making themselves go grind? Like, you know, I love this new, there's a new trend out there. That's all about dropping the grind and hustle, and being in the flow. So tell us a little bit more about that, and how that's possible for new leaders starting out?

Rhonda Williams: 00:22:55

Absolutely. You know, I'm actually working on the book. And this was inspired by my show coffee with Rhonda, the book is called leadership above the grind. Right? And I'm working on a whole leadership methodology for that. Because there is this thing where we've been in the grind, I hear people say, Oh, I'm on my grind, like, that's a positive thing. And I'm like, Oh, yeah, like, not so much for me. But, but what I recommend to leaders who are really engaging in this level of building and growing in your own organization, or with others is to, I have a strategy that I call five C's to stress free, right, five C's to stress free. And for a new leader, if you can implement this and execute this, then you have a really great opportunity to create your life as you are creating your business so that they are harmonious, right work life integration, or work life harmony is an important thing. So the first see, I will share is called clarity. And it's probably the most important one, what do you want, your personal time, your personal life and your business time and life to look like you got to make that decision. It doesn't just happen accidentally. So if you are not defining it, someone else will define it for you. Right? So you have to get clear on where you're going and what you want things to look like, as you are heading there. So that's the first thing. And then once you define that, then the next C is building up your self confidence in order to execute that to make that happen, right. And there's a lot of strategies that I give leaders about ways that you can grow your confidence. I think confidence is an internal renewable resource, right? You always have plenty of it. You just got to bring it to the surface. And the next C is choices. So now if you know what you want your life to look like you've built up your confidence to execute this. How do you make the choices day in and day out to make sure This is happening, because it's really all about choice. If you decide to work on your new podcast show from 7am till midnight, that's a choice that you made. And you might say, Well, I have to do that. It's a choice that you made, right. And so however you frame it is still a choice that you make. So thinking about the choices that you made to create that life that you want. And then the fourth seat is communication. Communication is not only external, verbal and nonverbal, but it's also head talk. It's also quieting your inner critic, right, and that self noise that says you can't do it, or that says to you, you have to work your fingers to the bone. Otherwise, this won't happen. Right? That voice is wrong, it doesn't have to work that way. And then the fifth C in the final seat is, once you set all of that out, it is then your responsibility to be consistent with it. Without consistency, it all falls apart. So I would offer that to your listeners as they are growing their podcast, their business, getting their teams on to be really clear about the five C's.

Michelle Abraham: 00:26:05

I love those five C's is a great framework. So the five C's distress free. And I think that's so cool. I'm the friends I my mind started wandering on the first one because I was like, Oh, yeah, like you don't if you don't have that clarity of what your what you want your schedule to look like, or even the I've been fighting with my calendar today. I was like, how do I put my appointments in here like this? Why do I have so many years? And you know, if you're, if you are thinking about your calendar, or your you know, what you how what you've created the work schedule, and you're like, Wait a second, I went in here and being an entrepreneur because I wanted more freedom in time. But I actually do not I have less of that now than if I work nine to five. So hang on a second here. How do I go back to why I went to do this in the first place and get a little bit more, I think that you hit it right there with it. First he is getting clarity about what do you want. Because if you don't know what you want, all of a sudden, your calendar is full with all these appointments and opportunities. And you're like, awesome, but now I'm like in the job again. And here I am 40 hours a week later. And one thing I'm definitely learning in business entrepreneurship is the systems will help make you have the freedom.

Rhonda Williams: 00:27:19

Michelle, it's so important what you just stated, because I would look at my schedule, and then get upset. I'm like, look at this, this today is gonna be awful. And then I'm like, oh, wait a minute, I made the schedule. Right?

Michelle Abraham: 00:27:31

I made it.

Rhonda Williams: 00:27:36

So it but if you're really clear about your boundaries, for instance, what time would do you want to wrap up in the evening? Do you want to work till midnight every night? And I want to just say this to everyone, if you're in the midst of that grind, and it makes you if it's a little scary to think oh my gosh, I can't not do this. Start small, one day a week or two days a week, can you say two days a week, I'm going to cut everything off at 7pm. And I'm going to spend time with my family, my loved ones by the swimming pool, reading a book, whatever that is. But you have to begin to start defining those boundaries and getting clear.

Michelle Abraham: 00:28:12

Yeah, amazing. I'm going into next week, the last four days, that my kids are in school for the summer, and no childcare or support during the summer. Other than just my husband and I working from home. So I was just we were talking about this last night, we were like what's our schedule gonna be like when the kids are off because we kind of got to be there. And I'm like, I am tired of working all summer we live on the lake. And I'm like, I spent all day in the office anyways. So I'm challenged myself to fit my work schedule into 6am to 11am, Monday to Friday. So I'm going to see if I can do that, which is why I have so many appointments today I had to remind myself that, uh, yes, I have a lot of points to say. But it's because I've just finished recording two months worth of podcast interview, so I don't need to record any over the summer. So that was what I was trying to do. And I had to remind myself when I looked at my calendar this morning, what the heck. And not to mention that podcast is my favorite thing to do in my business anyways. So it's it's an enjoyable long day, to get to touch amazing people. Yeah,

Rhonda Williams: 00:29:12

that's really good. Because you know, what you just described is not a sacrifice, it's a choice. You're making choices, because you see the big picture. And only you can see that. And that's an important point. As you define your clarity. That's from your vantage point. Don't expect everyone else to know it or understand it or even like it, but they don't need to you have to know what the big picture is that you're going for.

Michelle Abraham: 00:29:36

Yeah, I love that so much. So great. Those are those five C's. I think we need to be written on some walls and follow doctors. I think they're so great. So when I know before we started, you mentioned you have a gift for our audience. So tell us a little bit about that. Yeah, absolutely.

Rhonda Williams: 00:29:51

So I have a free ebook that talks about stress and the different ways that we show up in stress. So I will Love to offer for your audience to have a copy of that free ebook. It's called five C's to know five types of stressed out leaders, right and how to be stress free. So you want to look and identify what I love about it is for each type that we identify, we then identify strategies, right? that can help you if you're that type of stress leader, so they can go to stress free leaders.com stress free leaders calm for a copy of that free ebook. Awesome. Well, we'll put that in the show notes as well. So guys, make sure you go check it out. I

Michelle Abraham: 00:30:35

think that's the one thing like people love finding out about themselves. So that's a really great, that's a really great lead magnet just from the business side of things like such a great ideas. People love finding out what type are they? And then they can take that in and figure out the strategies that work with them. I think that's fantastic. So cool. I'm gonna go check it out as well. You guys run out. Thank you so much for being with us. You've been such a great guest. We've learned so much you've given so much value. So I really appreciate you being here with us today.

Rhonda Williams: 00:31:01

Oh, thank you so much for having me. Michelle. It was my pleasure to be here.